Turner +3 widen audio?

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479tx
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Turner +3 widen audio?

Postby 479tx » Fri Jun 06, 2014 9:31 am

Anyone know which caps to replace in a Turner +3 to widen the audio response up?
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Postby 479tx » Sat Jun 07, 2014 7:11 pm

I have my old school 148 w/ goldfinger's hifi tx mods and my turner +3 sounds pretty good, was thinking maybe I could change a cap or two in it for a little more low end.

Here's the schematic

http://www.radiomanual.info/schemi/ACC_ ... 3_user.pdf
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Postby Goldfinger » Sun Jun 08, 2014 12:32 pm

Image

1 - change to a 1 meg
2 - change to a 1 or 2.2uF
3 - change to a 10uF
4 - change to a .005uF (for more highs)
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Postby a365 » Sun Jun 08, 2014 10:13 pm

Thank you Goldfinger for sharing this mod :D
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Postby 479tx » Sun Jun 15, 2014 5:53 pm

I liked the results of this on my Turner +3

Thanks Goldfinger
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Re: Turner +3 widen audio?

Postby redlght » Fri Sep 09, 2016 1:46 pm

Any way to vary the tone on this mic? Thanks
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Re: Turner +3 widen audio?

Postby Goldfinger » Fri Sep 09, 2016 9:37 pm

Yes, you could change cap #4 to a .1uF then lift one end and connect a 100K potentiometer in series with it.
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Re: Turner +3 widen audio?

Postby redlght » Sat Sep 10, 2016 9:37 am

Thanks once again
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Re: Turner +3 widen audio?

Postby Goldfinger » Sat Sep 10, 2016 11:21 am

redlght wrote:Thanks once again


You bet.
The reason I said to change it to .1uF is so that when the tone is set all of the way down, it will attenuate the beyond that of an unmodified mic. It will end up having a wide range of adjustment.





"Turner +3 hi-fi bass mod"
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Re: Turner +3 widen audio?

Postby redlght » Sun Sep 25, 2016 8:57 pm

I don't seem to have much tone change if any ,,, does it matter if the 100k is on the ground side of cap 4?
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Re: Turner +3 widen audio?

Postby Goldfinger » Mon Sep 26, 2016 11:25 am

Try making the cap larger, .22 or .47
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Re: Turner +3 widen audio?

Postby redlght » Mon Sep 26, 2016 1:29 pm

ok a .47 has the most change so far .22 has no change .1 has no change
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Re: Turner +3 widen audio?

Postby redlght » Mon Sep 26, 2016 5:15 pm

all most more like a volume control towards the bass side
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Re: Turner +3 widen audio?

Postby 479tx » Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:15 pm

What does the resistor change here do specifically? I tried this set of mods on a Turner +3 before and liked the change in tone.

Thinking about doing it on another +3 mic for a friend.

Thanks
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Re: Turner +3 widen audio?

Postby Goldfinger » Tue Feb 27, 2018 3:22 pm

The higher load resistance changes the roll-off of the high impedance ceramic element allowing it to respond a little lower. Doesn't really change the gain much. Same trick people have been doing to the handheld D-104's to make them sound fuller.
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Re: Turner +3 widen audio?

Postby 479tx » Tue Feb 27, 2018 8:11 pm

That makes sense.

I happened to stumble across this thread on worldwidedx.com, this guy talks about replacing the caps in a Turner +3 with high end audiophile type caps to make the mic sound better than stock (so he says)

---

Rebuilding the microphone to sound better than new only requires a few select parts. These are parts known for audio quality & sound better than ordinary parts. The parts are:

2x 22uF @ 16 volt Elna Silmic II capacitors (replaces 20uF & 15uF)
2x 4.7uF @ 25 volt Elna Silmic II capacitors (replaces 5uF)
1x 2.2uF MKC 1862 poly type capacitor (replaces 5uF from volume control wiper to white wire audio output)
2x .47uF Panasonic Poly type capacitors (replaces tiny blue tantalum capacitors.

The poly type capacitors are larger, but will fit. Move the transistor slightly (bend over) and place the MKC 1862 capacitor on its side. The Elna Silmic are very fine audio grade capacitors and the poly types are great for audio. The original Tantalum are terrible sounding caps. Remember proper polarity with the new Silmic II capacitors. The poly types have no polarity, cannot install backwards. The schematic is on the internet.

Your microphone will sound more clear than ever with the new parts plus get back those nice high frequencies with the deep & powerful bass.

--

What's your take on his approach? Some of the caps he's suggesting replacing you don't mention increasing in value, was that because they appear to be large enough (pass enough low end) enough already? Just trying to learn as I play around.
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Re: Turner +3 widen audio?

Postby 479tx » Tue Feb 27, 2018 8:53 pm

What effect would making this cap smaller in value, like he suggests (possibly because he couldn't find one closer to the original, or make it fit?)
1x 2.2uF MKC 1862 poly type capacitor (replaces 5uF from volume control wiper to white wire audio output)

Would it decrease low bass frequencies? I see that they sell a 4.7uf cap of the same brand/type that's about the same size as the 2.2
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Re: Turner +3 widen audio?

Postby Goldfinger » Wed Feb 28, 2018 1:53 pm

Yeah, though I agree that using esoteric caps do make an audio signal "sound" better, it's usually only noticeable on a high end home stereo level when using speakers with good resolution. I've been using high end caps for decades in home stereo pre-amps, power amps and speaker crossovers. Every type of cap has it's own sound signature/tone that's independent of frequency range. For instance a 4.7uF polypropylene or foil-and-film capacitor will sound different and/or better than a 4.7uF electrolytic when used to crossover a high end silk dome tweeter. if you do a sweep and measure the crossover roll-off they will be identical in every way, yet the tone/timbre you hear coming out of the tweeter will sound noticeably different.
I have found using them in radio is unnecessary because they are bulky and the distortion levels present in CB audio sections coupled with the limited frequency response makes the merits of high end caps virtually indistinguishable.
I admit I do employ this gentleman's theory to a small degree. I usually advocate using tantalum instead of electrolytic in polarized circuits and mylar or polypropylene in non-polarized areas just for the possible positive qualities as compared to their counterparts. On many of the posts I also mentioned non-polar electrolytics as they still seen to work fine and it gives the hobbyist more choices for added availability.
The only way to get "more highs" is to decrease the value of shunt caps going to ground. Changing to "esoteric" caps will not add more sparkle, though the "tone" differences "may" be audible to a high end receiver with a speaker that has a tweeter. Also making any of the series caps lower in value will always make less low end, not more. It also depends on the load impedance of the following circuit as to whether a cap is large enough for the stage. Most of the other hobbyists I've seen on the internet don't seem to be able to discern these differences when they make these determinations.

I've been doing this a long time and I have to disagree that tantalum caps sound "shitty". They have lower ESR than electrolytics and sound much better in high-end stereo circuits. The only problems with tantalum is they short easier then any other polarized cap but it's only a problem in DC filtering/shunt circuits where they are under high demand. In series circuits with higher impedance values I've never seen a problem with them as long as the have a voltage rating with a good cushion for the application, which is true for any cap.
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Re: Turner +3 widen audio?

Postby 479tx » Thu Mar 01, 2018 12:56 pm

Awesome info! Thank you for the reply.

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